philosophy in the tragic age of the greeks

[raymond lulle]

philosophy in the tragic age of the greeks by neitzsche

has anyone read this ?

can anyone discuss with me the esoteric implications of some of the ancient greek philosophers theories on existence as expressed by neitszche in this book?

[isis]

i have not see this book in a long time and would love to talk to you about it sometime but i need to find it and reread it. so i can be up to date. the last time i read this box was when i was in high school well one of my high schools cause i have moved around alot.

isis

[raymond lulle]

ok so i will try to basically paraphrase some of the info presented in this book in reference to what would be deemed as esoteric.

Greek philosophy has created the "archetypes of philosophic thought"

the whole point of this book seems to be that the tragedy of greek philosophy is plato, or, i guess you could also assume, the death of socrates.

so his emphasis is on the pre-socratic philosophers

in that, pre-socratic philosophers are "pure types" as individual archetypes, whereas plato is a "mixed type" and that both "Pythogorean and Heraclitic elements are all combined into his doctrine of ideas" and far more important with these new types of "mixed type" philosophers is that they were the founders of sects and sectarianism" that were aposed to the earlier hellenistic culture.

It seems, for Nietzsche, the tragic age is the beginning of secular idealism (i.e the philosophical undertone of christianity, people are inherently sinners)

.....

some more info

"greek philosophy seems to begin with the absurd notion, with the proposition that water is the primal origin of all things."

behind this idea is "all things are one"

this is a revolutionary undertone to the idea or life as held before, such a notion of all things going back to common source made no sense to a culture of people who saw life as an illusion, a play world
controlled by god-men and spirits.

for modern man, some seem to be trapped to this idea, "all things are one" or that all things go back to some common source (ie, god, bigbang)

as occultists on this site, im sure a lot of the bloggers here experience life more like the latter, in the more spiritual sense of the ancient hellen greeks, seeing life as being an illusion and that we are somewhere in the middle of a greater plan of higher levels of being influence what reality actually is.

from here on, in this first idea proposed by "Thales" Nietzsche then follows some what of a path of the logic and creative imagination of the following philosophers after Thales. In dong this he seems to be, and i guess as a rude comparison i want to use tarrot cards, as creating a path of archetypes.

I want to skip forward then to Heraclitus.

he is really trying to get the idea of "hybris" across.

in that, not excepting reality as it is, is a direct violation, or i guess, a "hybris" against god.

So he asks "Do guilt, injustice, contradiction, and suffering exist in this world?"

"They do proclaims Heraclitus, but only for the limited mind which sees things apart but not connected, not for the con-tuitive god." ("intuition")

this point on, it is important to mention, Thales idea, starts with "water" and Heraclitus sees "all things as one" as being "fire".

"Heraclitus only describes the world as it is" and considers people with "antipathies" and "sympathies" as "negligible"

Finally

Nietzsche then gos on and seemingly in his own opinion to state "Such dissatisfied people are also responsible for the numerous complaints about the OBSCURITY of Heraclitus' style"

"How can people imagine that a philosopher would intentionally write obscurely-as they often say of Heraclitus-barring that he has good cause for HIDING certain thoughts"

he then quotes Jean Paul

"it is quite right if great things-things of much sense for men or rare sense-are expressed but briefly and (hence) darkly, so that barren minds will declare it to be NONSENSE....For mean, vulgar minds have an ugly facility for seeing in the profoundest and most pregnant utterance only their everyday opinion."


my last thoughts, Occult and Esoteric both basically mean Hidden,

also compare, Al-Jabir to Jiberish.

[isis]

yes i remeber and yes i will defently need to reread that book so much i have for gotten it saprises me.