Noncorporeal Beings

[Gazeeboh]

What do they do?

I just read some article about how spirits of the leaf people made marijuana in some pact with the crystal people in an effort to harvest human thoughts and emotions for a glowing pi symbol in the leaf realm.

Thats cool, and you should read it too. But..

What is the point? What are they doing? Is the spirit world the same as ours but with different flavors, new shiny things, bizzare locations and wrong physics? Are they really just as boring as we are, toiling away and working their spiritual asses off for some goal oriented task?

The most prevelant theory is that they all want a piece of the physical. They all want in, or at least to have a role to play from the sidelines. They usually use us, humans, to achieve this aim. They give us wonderful gifts and most are a distraction while they do there work through us.

Invocation, evocation. Do we just call them here for a little trading. You scratch my hairy monkey back and i'll scratch your ectoplasm?

What are you thoughts on the aims of the spirit world? Are they up to something totally mind blowing and incomprehensible to us silly men and women, or are they really not so different?

Please enjoy your stay and remember todays special is clam chowder. enjoy.

[OneSixTheAntiVirus]

The spirit world is a difficult subject to discuss intelligently simply because we know so little about that aspect of life. I can only speculate so bear with me. I think spirit beings are very similar to us in that there are benevolent ones, malevolent ones, and indifferent ones. Wherever you go in this universe control and manipulation are there and since we can assume that spirits are very powerful and intelligent beings, a certain amount of trepidation overcomes me whenever I think about such things because I know how dumb I am.

Intriguing insight about the origins of marijuana, Gaz. Where can I read more?

[Gazeeboh]

Thanks guys. Your input is wonderful.

I read it on RealitySandwich

http://www.realitysandwich.com/green_underworld_part_1_2

So, human ghosts I can see going on to be humans. At least until they turn into something else, like a demi-god or toad (which might be the same thing from an archetypal point of view)

But the other spirits, the ones who aren't in our physical reality, do the same stuff as us?

Maybe I'm getting it wrong. Maybe they aren't "un physical". I think more likely, that they are just on another level, higher vibes or something hokey like that. Maybe we aren't quite real to them, just some whispy ghost stuffs, while thier world is the most solid and real.

Once I look at it like that it makes a bit more sense. But still....

Is there no reality that is so mind blowingly different from our own? Are they all full of work in such a familiar fashion? Are they all so goal oriented? Is there not some far flung existence that has nothing to do with anything we can concieve of?

I guess we can't tell, because if we could, then it would be known.

Ugh

What are you guys up to after you die?

[Nefilim]

I'm sorry, but everytime I see this all I can think of is 'CORPOREAL JIGSORE QUANDRY', I had to mention it.

[Gazeeboh]

I never got into that stuff. Just metal. Now I just like sexy music and most recently I'm enjoying Eagles of Death Metal "Heart On" maybe a bit too much. You really haven't seen sexy until you have seen their singer Boots Electric.

Do you think other world guys dig music?

[Royal Heart]

I think OneSixTheAntiVirus nailed it. There's some interesting ideas in Chinese mythology about every spirit have a rank and a function in a formally organized Celestial Bureaucracy. It was said that the bureaucratic systems of the Chinese Empires were modeled after those in Heaven and that it was Heaven who gave its authority for the Emperor to rule.

So this means that every god had another god it answered to, and others it had to look after and provide for. If a spirit did something it wasn't supposed to do, it was its superiors' duty to deal with it.

There's a fascinating tidbit from Japan regarding a kitsune (fox spirit) where Toyotomi Hideyoshi, a high government official, wrote a letter to Inari (the Japanese kami of fertility, rice, agriculture, foxes, industry, and worldly success).


To Inari Daimyojin,

My lord, I have the honor to inform you that one of the foxes under your jurisdiction has bewitched one of my servants, causing her and others a great deal of trouble. I have to request that you make minute inquiries into the matter, and endeavor to find out the reason of your subject misbehaving in this way, and let me know the result.

If it turns out that the fox has no adequate reason to give for his behavior, you are to arrest and punish him at once. If you hesitate to take action in this matter I shall issue orders for the destruction of every fox in the land. Any other particulars that you may wish to be informed of in reference to what has occurred, you can learn from the high priest of Yoshida.

[PerfectCell]

Their are a lot of crystals in my bud :P

Yummy.

[Manbearpig]

Interesting post. I'd like to read more about it.

The concept of spiritual beings is a difficult one for me as there are so many differing explanations and theories and so many new age "inventions".

I tend to think, most of the time, that those spiritual entities that we can identify are outer/inner reflections. In other words, what exists outside of us is reflected in an aspect of our psyche, whether good or bane, and what is within our psyche is reflected outward into a manifestation of spiritual existence. Very subjective, I know, but that's about as far as I've managed to get.

As for ghosts, etc., I don't really know how all that would fit in to this scheme. Then there are the vast myriad of "elemental" beings conjectured by writers such as Conway and Cunningham (Selkies, Nymphs, Drakes, all those) that I tend not to have much belief in. I get argued with quite alot by the local pagans. And of course, that would lead me to always question and re-analyze my idea of the moment. If I find the archangelic forces to be of great use to me and they find more use in fairies, to each their own, I guess.

[Lady Dunsany]

Until you actually deal with the ones from the lower realm it is a moot point.

[fishcakes]

Have always had my doubts about the spiritual world. Relatives hanging around just to pass on inanities when you are all sat around the ouija board. Still i find this a little more believable that hauntings, hanging around in some gothic drafty manor house throwing stones at gullible psychics. I DONT THINK SO! The female changing rooms and football stadiums would be full of the male deceased. Thronged. Is that ectoplasm?????<------f*ck! sorry!

Still....
Its been said that mankind never dies nor steps outside of eternal life. Newton (as we all know) said ......
Hall said that we are not reborn but that our energy goes to infuse new life. That we are not a single life in a procesion of bodies but are rather a blending of energy and that memories of past lives are illusion.

[isis]

i have been reading this thrid for awile and i am confused to the point of looking this up and then i will give a response or i will agree with lady d. cause i see spirits and have been seeing them for awile now eversense i was 12 but i only seen them at night but now i see them at all hours of the day but i am going to look it up...

[Lady Dunsany]

[QUOTE=fishcakes;4194]Have always had my doubts about the spiritual world. Relatives hanging around just to pass on inanities when you are all sat around the ouija board. Still i find this a little more believable that hauntings, hanging around in some gothic drafty manor house throwing stones at gullible psychics. I DONT THINK SO! The female changing rooms and football stadiums would be full of the male deceased. Thronged. Is that ectoplasm?????<------f*ck! sorry!

Still....
Its been said that mankind never dies nor steps outside of eternal life. Newton (as we all know) said ......
Hall said that we are not reborn but that our energy goes to infuse new life. That we are not a single life in a procesion of bodies but are rather a blending of energy and that memories of past lives are illusion.[/QUO Gullible Psychics? Your mind is not open at all. If you are interested in anything Occult you must open your mind and realize that all is possible. Otherwise you might as well stick to coffee table books.

[Royal Heart]

The problem with the word "spirits" is that it's a bit vague, kind of like "chest pain". The nature, causes and consequences are so varied, it's dizzying. To some, spirits are only those of the departed, to others this term includes angels, demons, gods, elementals, et cetera.

I think it'd be helpful if we all stated what, exactly, we mean when we post about "spirits". Then there wouldn't be as much confusion or bickering.

[Royal Heart]

In your paradigm, is the term "spirit" exclusive to intelligences which were, at some point, human or a human-derivative?

[Royal Heart]

That is very close to the definition I work with. Question: How would you classify an entity that does not have a form composed of conventional mass particles which is not self-aware?

[Lady Dunsany]

In your paradigm, is the term "spirit" exclusive to intelligences which were, at some point, human or a human-derivative?


Both. I have to tell you this thread was not meant to be serious as the poster never posts anything serious. All I can say is he did make all think did he not?

[Lady Dunsany]

That is very close to the definition I work with. Question: How would you classify an entity that does not have a form composed of conventional mass particles which is not self-aware?
An energy or spiritual embryo. We were all mass particles to start with. When we die the physical is consumed back into the void. Our astral if one believes this goes into the astral world waiting to be re incarnated or not. The higher part atma hovers above and waits for the new body to form again from the void. Now this is one way of looking at it. This discussion is really one that no matter your belief or opinion is it is of the personal and your own path of belief one no matter how hard you try can not possibly explain it or enlighten anyone if they believe different. It is all very individual.

[Lady Dunsany]

I know. I was theorizing at what others believe. The most I can say is come visit the least I can say is don't.

[Royal Heart]

An entity not composed of massless particles without self awareness would be less of an entity in my book and more of a pattern. This is going to be difficult to explain. There are some energies that have a repeating pattern and certainly give the appearance that something is "at the wheel" so to speak. I never really came up with a term for them but I suppose a simulcra would be appropriate.
That makes sense to me, although I'm hesitant to use the term "entity" when referring to a pattern. For my own purposes only I make the distinction between a spirit (self-aware) and a ghost (entity repeating a pattern without consciousness or will). A ghost, in my paradigm, is a shell. A human-like residue that follows the pattern it was left with until it degrades and dissipates.

A ghost can be classified as a pattern, but not all patterns are ghosts. Spirits are able to make choices and react to changing situations. Ghosts are incapable of this, as are patterns. Patterns can be changed, but not by their own choice - since they don't have the conscious will to make choices.

[S33k3R]

Perhaps their plane of existence has something to do with it.

You can call up your dead ancestors or grandfather and have conversations with them, (big in Africa)...but you can't have a conversation with dead uncle Albert who haunts the bathroom down the hall and is constantly flushing the toilet.

Perhaps "patterned ghosts" never made it to the correct realm...or got stuck halfway. Perhaps their "consciousness" got separated from their spiritual body.

wow...That must suck.

[Harlock]

I believe that the spirit world is our world, just the energy of it, and I believe its when we astral travel or become ghosts we walk through this realm, that is why it always seems theres a turn that is not there in some places, or writing on a wall that isn't there in this world, it is the energy of everything, sort of like the wire frame of a video game, and i do not believe that spirits or well not all of them are out to get us, I think most would like to just have corporeal bodies...in my opinion again, and all of the spirits come from different realms, and ours is at the center of it all, the nexus, thats why No one can just march up to the heavens, they have to battle there way through here first. But like many have said, they just want to live here and have a slice of the pie for the most part, I mean don't we all?