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Thread: Is a fusion of....

  1. #1
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    Default Is a fusion of....

    traditional or "old system" ceremonial magick and a more element-based paganism possible in anyone's experience? In other words, can a magickian with qabala and goetic background (among other traditions) become a productive member of a basically elemental neo-pagan coven or are is there just too great an abyss between the two concepts. Would there be too much that the ceremonialist would have to "give up" or too much for the neo-pagans to "learn" in order to make it a workable group?

    I'd be interested in hearing what anyone thinks about this.

  2. #2
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    Lady Dunsany Guest

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    Now that is a good question. I belong to a few different orders and I can tell you they do not want to know from Adam what I do at the other's having said that, if you are talking about Druidism for example there are Christian druids, Pagan Druids, etc. As far as diversity, but there is no way I could bring my workings from the GD to another order. So in my case no.
    An example I belong to a Wiccan forum an a all no holds bar fight broke out between the old school of witches which I will call traditional and the new school which is modern. It was not pretty. This was on a forum where every one was supposed to be welcomed. There are orders that practice Enochian and would never entertain the notion of Goetia. It is the same as saying my Mercedes is the best and I would not drive a Volkswagen.
    Last edited by Lady Dunsany; 01-19-2009 at 05:23 PM. Reason: spelling

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    There are orders that practice Enochian and would never entertain the notion of Goetia. It is the same as saying my Mercedes is the best and I would not drive a Volkswagen.
    both cars get you somewhere though.
    Mantra yeahhhh. Eggshells you smell.

    http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i1...-BookWorld.jpg

  4. #4
    L
    Lady Dunsany Guest

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    You are right, but tell that to the old craft and the new.

  5. #5
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    Lady Dunsany Guest

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    This is true up to to a point if you are dabbling. Once you take the oath regarding your order there is no deviating from the path you have chosen. I doubt my order would be amused if I suddenly walked in and said let's learn something else. You can dabble all you want and get your feet wet in the shallow, but once you decide to plunge into deep water then you take a vow to respect and go with the wishes of the order. It is what happened with JM Greer when his GD order would not accept Natural Magick he left. Yes you can try new things but you will not be able to bring them in the confines of your group. They will hear you out but that is about it.

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    Default

    So pressed for time today....

    Thanks for all your responses.

    I'm talking mainly the fusion of a sort of eclectic Druidism with more traditional ceremonial magick, such as the Golden Dawn and OTO systems.

    Thus far it's been quite difficult getting everyone of the same page and I don't like to stir up conflict where I'm the newbie, if you know what I mean.

  7. #7
    L
    Lady Dunsany Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cascara View Post
    Hi Manbearpig,

    Just to ensure that I get this correct (Had on another forum people getting upset that Pagans are not Wiccans but Wiccans are Pagans etc. in other words identity confusion).

    Are we talking Wiccan ritual or more the Norse Pagan kinda thing?
    Or you can be a wiccan without being a witch and you can be a witch without being a wiccan I have had that asked of me. I believe we are talking about mixing ceremonial magick ie if with an order and trying to impart another path you are pursuing at that order. If we are talking in general terms of what one practices on their own then you can mix all you want.
    Last edited by Lady Dunsany; 01-21-2009 at 10:35 PM.

  8. #8
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    Lady Dunsany Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vir Sapiens View Post
    Well I imagine this would not be something that could really be formalized like that. I wouldn't expect an order to adopt new practices just because someone felt like experiementing but within the realm of the sole practicioner I'm fairly certain the techniques could be blended without any trouble. Chaotes do it all the time, a little of this, a little of that and you have yourself a paradigm.

    I see what you're saying but it seems that the only real obstacle would be the mindset of your order and their outlook on you as a member should you attempt this as opposed to an inimicable reaction within your workings. That is one thing that kind of turned me off to organized magical orders was the sublimation of the individual will to the will of the path. I totally get where you are coming from though and perhaps I misinterpreted the question. I saw it as more of a "would this work" type thing.
    I just got back from one of my orders, and in that respect they do let us change our SOP around with different God names if we are uncomfortable with the Druid names. Also we are allowed to join the Golden Dawn for our second year studies in Magick or if we are in an order which I already am we can infuse some of that work. It appears the Druids of Natural Magick are a bit more understanding. My GD order frowns on anything not of the teachings. I can tell you one thing if i am unhappy in any order I belong to I would walk away rather than do the rituals and teachings they give me if I am not of the same mindset. I would not call it subliminal that is basically saying one is being brainwashed which I can assure you I am not. It really has to do with what the order thinks is best for the member and they know we all belong to other orders and paths, this is just a little piece of me it does not consume me. It is what I need to do at this time. I like the camaraderie of my order and the fact that we help each other and work with each other. I am also a solitary too. So far this has worked for me and I have not gotten any of my work confused with the other, at least not yet.
    Last edited by Lady Dunsany; 01-21-2009 at 10:48 PM. Reason: spelling

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