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Many that are seekers on a dark path stumble across those who have crafted a crooked journey. They lie!
This thread was authored so as to assist the sincere seeker who may stumble across one such fork in the road, so that they realize there's time to turn back before they even begin to take that first step.
Chloe Ortega Hides and Wins Pseudo Satanist Honors 2009 Fake Order Award
LINK
Blessed Journey in the light of the dark flame,
S.
the link doesn't work.
That was my error. I should have confirmed the link before committing to post. Please try again. :)
like the link..i will take a closer look at it... thanks for posting it...
It has been rumored for years that the ONA never actually existed. I have read some of "their" writings before and found them way too extreme to take seriously. If someone actually practiced what the ONA teaches, they would end up in prison or dead in a matter of no time. Extremely impractical stuff.
We have an ONA member here. He is still alive, as far as I know.
I just went over that thread. This is what I was referring to:Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Dunsany
"Well for me walking 80 miles and living in seclusion for 3 months is impractical".
I have read The ONA's The Black Book of Satan parts I,II & III by the way, so I am not completely ignorant of their supposed practices.
I will simply say that their direction is not for me, especially since some of it advocates criminal activity (not sure if all the writing is literal or not).
I don't think that the actual system itself requires criminality. I don't think even the ONA itself requires one to be a career criminal.Quote:
Originally Posted by StarlessAeon
Nevertheless I regard the system detailed in Naos as useful and can be practised independently of the Order without running afoul of the law.
Nothing wrong with that then. If it works, use it. I just find it self-defeating to work magic outside of legal means.Quote:
Originally Posted by Thrnn
I completely agree. It would be exceedingly difficult to practice magic whilst on the wrong side of the law.Quote:
Originally Posted by StarlessAeon
I posted in the ona thread that the maxim from the grimoire of Lady Sheba
"and ye harm none, do what ye will"
is the exception to the rule
and holy war is mental and does not manifest on the physical plane
I speak of Jihad because the founder of ONA is Islamic now
Is this a rumor or has this been verified? If he has actually converted to Islam that throws the credibility of the ONA's complete "history" right out the window. Not that I agreed with him in the first place anyways.Quote:
Originally Posted by chronazon
muhammed only criticized the Jews because they would not accept christ, and the quran, although distinctly arabic, was the completion of the trilogy and The Quran is the Gypsy bible anyway, so for those who follow the path of Caine, it is a great protector, although channeled from "a" higher power.
I could imagine Mike Ford saying even though it affirms the Caananites (you'd actually have to have read the bibl;e for that, well what good is that, earth is really messed up, and many people, such as you, doubt everything, higher power aside.
I think, as the KKK's primary founding purpose was to fool and decieve the publikkk, that all aethism, and especially the mental mechanisms that lead to skepticism are in fact products of klan's synthetic cokkke. just what us natives need, more empty headed white people tromping up on the land.
as to the ONA...you have no idea how stupid doubting them is. you have no idea what the seventies were...scum
This makes absolutely no sense.Quote:
Originally Posted by chronazon
The problem I see is this :Quote:
Originally Posted by Eretik
How can one go from founding a group based on the "secrets" of "Traditional Satanism" to then later converting to Islam?
Whether or not they are both enemies of the Christians and Jews is beside the point.
Islam is just as against any form of Satanism, as it views all others religions as forms of Satanism!
Satan (Shaitan) is the enemy of Allah. This would make the ONA a potential enemy of Islam as well. It simply makes no sense.
Satanism and Islam are simply NOT compatible.
No problem. Happy birthday by the way.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eretik
If one were to read the ONA MSS more carefully they would have noticed there is a lot of information pertaining to infiltrating different belief systems. Whether they are national socialist, Islamic or otherwise. The ONA during personal initiation asks of one to hold differing beliefs (doublethink?) and pursue a second life or career devoted to the opposite teachings of Satanism. I'm not here to argue whether this is beneficial or practical, it is just simply the method that they tend to work with.
As for legality and magick; witches have practiced outside of the law for some time in days of old and it is almost required of one to go against society's values when one embarks upon a life of witchcraft or Satanism. Personally it may be difficult for one to operate outside of the law, but it certainly is no limiting factor.
since the KKK's purpose was to fool and decieve the public, anytime people don't agree, now a days, it is the work of them. I can see how this applies to what was just said about holding differant belief systems. old religoins aere just an artifact of things past, but have a lot of truth, even for satanists.
to do any kind of serious work with negative currents, you must understand them, and religion was created to make society better, not to find the bad things in society, whether you are destroying or diverting them. there definitly is alot written about the Shaitan/devils whatever in all religious texts and many times too, the people TRYING to follow religion do the worst things in society.
Going against society's so-called "values" and being a criminal are two different things. I'm not concerned with when witchcraft was illegal in earlier times. I am concerned about right now in the society I live in. Most of the victims of the Salem Witch Trials, for example, were not even real witches. It was Christian propaganda and mass hysteria.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ulvblod ov Fenrir
i'm talking about owning mad piles of free money from the slave trade/free labor and owning infrastructure...corporate opiates and creating linker chemicals in everyday food products, thus creating the status quo. You shouldn't have listened to that kind of contradictory logic from them. sounds scaryQuote:
Originally Posted by Vir Sapiens
Satanism does not involve an "Infernal Mandate". If you actually lend credence to anything that this Blackwood person implies, then I would have to seriously question your intelligence along with the so-called "real Satanists" of the Temples of Satan. Or as I like to affectionately refer to them: "ToS-ers."Quote:
Originally Posted by spell forest
The Order of the Nine Angles defines Satanism as a means to the end of Self-Development. Real world experiences, not cutting and pasting and critiquing other people's work.
I personally know of an O9A member who served in the military and even did a combat tour in Iraq. I would lend more credence to someone like that rather than someone who has a pseudo Satanic group and who claims that Satan speaks to him.
As far as I know, the White Star Acception (with Chloe Ortega) are a full-functioning Nexion of the Order of Nine Angles. Their Satanism is not for everyone but that is more than acceptable since Satanism is about different, unique, individual perspectives of Satanism. I sense a tinge of jealousy from Blackwood aka Tom Raspotnik because he attempted to gain membership into the O9A but was rejected a few years ago.
Now Tom is attempting to besmirch various groups via the internet because of a feeling of self-loathing because of failure.
Quote:
Originally Posted by spell forest
"Grand Magister" Blackwood's self-idolatry is laughable at best. His illusion of self-grandeur thoroughly reflects his envy of young, intelligent, vibrant young people who happened to admire ONA edicts and principles.
For those interested in the other side of the story and not be spoonfed by delusioned individuals, check here if you have the opportunity:
http://www.wsanexus.darkbb.com
For us, Satanism is an individual quest because it aims to produce unique, strong, individuals who do not need the support of groups, of dogma, ethics, a religion, of some pontificating poseur of a ‘master’. Thus, the ONA exists to offer advice and guidance - to point the way. The individual must begin the quest, and they and they alone must continue with it.
The Way is difficult and very few follow it. In some ways, this is unfortunate - for we believe the way offers anyone the opportunity to advance along the path to genuine Adeptship and beyond. It makes real, or can make real, the potential that most individuals possess - the latent genius within. However, given human nature the small numbers are understandable. What the ONA has done - over the past thirty years or so - is to create a simple practical system which works: which can produce genuine Adepts and Masters/Lady Masters. In effect, we have distilled the essence from thousands of years of conscious understanding, producing an elixir, an ‘internal alchemy’, which anyone can use.
We describe this system as Satanic, as Sinister because it is. It is a complete rejection of the philosophy/religion of the Nazarene. The philosophy/religion of the Nazarene is anti-life and anti-evolutionary, as Nietzsche, for example, understood. For us, Satan is both an archetype or symbol of our defiance, and some-thing real - the re-presentation of what we describe as ‘the acausal’. That is, we understand the ‘darker forces’ as not simply a part of our psyche (as most modern so-called Satanic groups do) - but as beyond our own, individual psyche. These darker forces - or the acausal - are beyond us, as individuals: they are beyond our conscious control (and even real understanding) until we become a part of them. This does not mean a submission to those forces - but rather an expanding of individual consciousness, a development of individual conscious, to include those forces. This expansion is what marks the genuine Satanic Master/Lady Master.
Satanic groups like Blackwood's lay claim that the darker forces are merely an aspect of the psyche, the unconscious or whatever. They do this for two reasons. First, they need to - because they want to feel safe; they want to be able to play their pseudo-Satanic, pseudo-intellectual, games in a mostly urbanized safety, because the members of such groups are not proud, characterful, self-aware individuals: they need the comfort of a group, of a ‘leader’, of ethical guidelines, of feeling that Satan can be controlled by some meaningless mumbo-jumbo. In effect, the members and leaders of these groups are weak - they lack self-discipline; they lack even the desire for real self-mastery, content as they are to continue with edifying their own weaknesses, with massaging their inflated egos.
Second, such groups and their members do not really comprehend the Sinister. They have had no real experience of the primal, numinous, supra-personal power of the dark forces - of how that power can destroy individuals. In effect, they have never really ‘tapped into’ the acausal itself - to what is really sinister. They have never really confronted Satan. They have never really striven to be like Satan - to become one with Him; to merge with the acausal itself; to become a ‘nexion’ for the acausal, for sinister energies. This becoming-one is what makes, what creates a genuine Satanic Master/Lady Master, as living alone like a hermit creates the Adept. It is dangerous, naturally - but the only means whereby that synthesis which is beyond the synthesis that is individuation can be achieved. There is thus a real, a genuine, transcending beyond ‘good’ and ‘evil’; beyond ‘light’ and ‘dark’. This achievement, as with all real achievements of an Occult kind, originates from practical experience - from a real personal knowledge. Anything else is posing, is irrevelant.
Other groups have tried to ‘intellectualize’ Satanism - to take away the real experiences by which genuine Satanic character is formed. Or they wallow in the weaknesses of those addicted to impulses they cannot understand and they lack the strength to control. They have attempted and continue to attempt and make Satanism respectable and safe - just another ‘religion’. They fantasize, and play games. They simply do not understand Satanism as a means to create new, more highly evolved, individuals. In reality, the genuine Satanist creates by participating in real life, the dreams, the standards of excellence, the élan which others often aspire to emulate. A genuine Satanist can be like a beast of prey - in real life.
Alas, Satanism is but a means to an end. The end is to achieve Self-Development.
ISS,
Sinistar666
O9A:352
Sinistar666,
Thanks for contributing to this thread. It is nice to hear from someone who is actually a member, rather than rely on internet rumors.
The pleasure is all mine. For months, Chloe Ortega has fended off verbal attacks by this Grand Magister Blackwood. I felt that it was not necessary to display my alliances here until I saw that post coming from someone who had nothing to do with the problems between Chloe and Blackwood.
To each Satanist, the journey or path is a unique one. It is for the most part, the undertaking is on an individual basis. There is no teaching, only guidance where it is appropriate.
Can someone truly say that they are the "voice of Satanism" as Blackwood does?
May your journey bring you enlightenment whether it be a Satanic Path or otherwise.
In Satanic Solidarity,
Sinistar666
yes I understand. Thank god I understand.....Why am I so knowing?Quote:
Originally Posted by sinistar666
Blackwood, LaVey, Aquino - Guilty as ChargedQuote:
Originally Posted by Sinistar666
Not to belittle your comment, but I'd like to know your reasoning for thinking that a soldier that served in Iraq deserves more respect than one who does not. It could be argued well that such a person would be seen as a lesser Satanist because of his willingness to serve an institution that is not of his making, to surrender his will to the will of the state, and to imperil his own well-being to support an effort to defend political ego.
This is my take on it anyhow.
From what I gathered, the Blackwood situation was just a farce. Granted, prior to all the ordeals over at the old Occult Forums, I'd never even heard the name, but I was under the impression it was an utterly moot situation not even worthy of discussion.
It was actually Jezebel Diva who stated that she would lend more credence to a combat veteran.
I would imagine that she stated this because of the computer Satanists who sit around and call everyone else fake. The soldier, regardless of the politics and alleged subservience would have respect because this constitutes overall life experience. Real world actions and the discipline that is taught through rigorous training.
It's quite simple for others to say, "I'm not participating in anything or doing anything because I don't believe in it. I'm a Satanist, everybody sucks, I'm my own god, yada, yada, yada." Yet, how can someone like this build character unless he/she gets off the computer and live?
Of course, joining the military isn't the only means to test oneself, and his /her fortitude. There are other ways, but being a keyboard warrior isn't one of them.
The Blackwood situation over at the .com was a farce, a satire of Blackwood. Not worth many people's time, but the Kabuki act did entertain others.
after seeing the different views and the teachings of the practice I see that it is the same for all beliefs and which is the more suitable teachings to follow
as for me I am gaining a deeper understanding thanks all for posts and the explanations
yes i agree this thread is insterating and i know i say this in all the thread pertaning to Satanism but i am insterated in it and want to learn more.
well I may change your mind after reading my post, it may not be so interesting afterall....