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Thread: Linking the Major Arcana with the Runes

  1. #1
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    Default Linking the Major Arcana with the Runes

    Just wondering...anybody got any insight into correlating the 22 Major Arcana with the runes.

    I know that in theory the two systems don't really overlap, but Edred Thorsson's book, Futhark, a Handbook of Rune Magic has a table that links the two...except his suck. Like linking Fehu with the Tower...Ansuz with Death?...WTF? How the hell that works is beyond me. One or two of his associations makes sense, like Linking Gyfu with The lovers...actually thats the only one that makes sense.

    Now I'm sure that this isn't an amazingly original idea and that somebody here has done more than have a random game of pin the donkeys tail.

    All insight most appreciated.
    Prick your finger it is done
    The Moon has now eclipsed the Sun
    The Angel has spread its wings
    The time has come for bitter things

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    Ehwaz with the lovers, reversed Ansuz with the fool, Iewaz with death. If I knew more of the tarot cards and their meanings, I could tell you others.
    "Now it's you know who, I got the you know what. I'll stick it you know where, you know why, you don't care..." -- Marylin Manson

  3. #3
    R
    redhand Guest

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    This can depend on your overall understanding of the Runes and the Tarot. I use Edred Thorsson's correspondences myself as I don't agree with Handel's or the Norse Tarot deck. This is based on understanding from the Rune Poems.

    Fehu - The Tower
    Ur -
    The Priestess
    Thursaz - The Emperor
    Ansuz - Death
    Raido - Hierophant
    Kenaz - Chariot
    Gebo - Lovers
    Wunjo - Strength
    Hagalaz - World
    Naudhiz - Devil
    Isa - Hermit
    Jera - Fool
    Eihwaz - Hanged Man
    Perthro - Wheel of fortune
    Algiz - Moon
    Sowilo - Sun
    Tiwaz - Justice
    Birkano - Empress
    Ehwaz - Lovers
    Mannaz - Magician
    Laguz - Star
    Ingwaz - Judgement
    Dagaz - Temperance
    Othala - Moon


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    I don't think Uruz, the wild raging ox, would be the priestess. Perhapse that's Fehu. Maybe Uruz is the tower, or something in the club suit. And Thurisaz is supposed to be the rune of the devil, not Nauthiz. Anyway, I don't think you will find an accurate table of correspondences unless you make one yourself. I don't know much about tarot but I know a lot about the runes, so I will try to make one for you.
    "Now it's you know who, I got the you know what. I'll stick it you know where, you know why, you don't care..." -- Marylin Manson

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    Fehu - fehu is female, perhapse it is the priestess. It also means "wealth"
    Uruz- Strength
    Thurisaz - devil/ war
    Ansuz - Hanged Man
    Raido - Chariot
    Kenaz - sun/ star
    Gebo - gift
    Wunjo - A rune of good luck or acheiving your desire.
    Hagalaz - tower
    Naudhiz - perhapse not the Devil. nauthiz means "need" and is also a symbol of poverty, but it is also a rune of the lower realms.
    Isa - Hermit
    Jera - Means year and is a symbol of time.
    Eihwaz - Death
    Perthro - priestess or Wheel of fortune perth means "mystery" and is a symbol of a cup. It is feminine.
    Algiz - I really don't know. Algiz is a good rune for escapists, so maybe the magician?
    Sowilo - Sun
    Tiwaz - Justice/ judgement
    Birkano - Tis is the rune of the body, so I am saying strength. Who knows, it could be the empress...
    Ehwaz - Lovers. Definately.
    Mannaz - possibly not the Magician
    Laguz - Star/ magician
    Ingwaz -moon
    Dagaz - sun
    Othala - A rune of blood and family, as well as tradition.
    "Now it's you know who, I got the you know what. I'll stick it you know where, you know why, you don't care..." -- Marylin Manson

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    ...There you go...thats at least slightly more sensible. Thanks I suspect I would link Gifu with the lovers...but thats just my interpretation of things. As stated, one would really have to make up your own. Its actually quite a useful exercise to do...gets you thinking.

    Nice one.
    Prick your finger it is done
    The Moon has now eclipsed the Sun
    The Angel has spread its wings
    The time has come for bitter things

  7. #7
    R
    redhand Guest

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    Hmmm, well actually as you develop a deeper understanding of the Runes themselves you will understand why Thorsson suggest them the way he does. Runes are not just a divination tool nor is the Tarot!

    Look at Fehu, of course the surface or mundane meaning is "money" or "cattle" but, this Rune also contains the mystery of both creation and destruction and the harmonious function of these two extremes. Remember that bovine aspect also represents the Cosmic Fire of Muspellsheimr that is instrumental in the creation of the world but, at the same time, also is the principle agent in it's destruction of Ragnarok! So here you can see why it relates to the Tower!LOL

    Ansuz is simple to explain in it's correspondence with the Death card as it is the Rune of Death mysteries and transformation!

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    Arrow

    I would look for runes to have more correspondance to crystals and geomancy than a correlation with the tarot, although for divinitory purposes, runes seem to do more with differant forces in events than the more archtypal (although runes are archtypal in their own way, just a differant way of looking at things) tarot, which is a differant system in the way things happen. I guess this would call into question the runic perspective and divinitory interprative diferances. I think they should all be incorporated nito something with gong he fot choy, a chinese fortune telling system used with the regular card deck (could perhaps the major aracna fall into suit place with the differant minor aracna subsets?) and the I ching, with another regular card deck as a linked subset of the tarot. they should all be incorporated into a master system. any more thoughts?
    I have seen a thousand thousand civilizations rise and fall upon the Mother of All Things. As pipes play, echoing off the mountains and across the Ocean, until it fades at the edge of time, the end of All... - book of the gate called pan

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    Default

    Hmmm, well actually as you develop a deeper understanding of the Runes themselves you will understand why Thorsson suggest them the way he does. Runes are not just a divination tool nor is the Tarot!

    Look at Fehu, of course the surface or mundane meaning is "money" or "cattle" but, this Rune also contains the mystery of both creation and destruction and the harmonious function of these two extremes. Remember that bovine aspect also represents the Cosmic Fire of Muspellsheimr that is instrumental in the creation of the world but, at the same time, also is the principle agent in it's destruction of Ragnarok! So here you can see why it relates to the Tower!LOL

    Ansuz is simple to explain in it's correspondence with the Death card as it is the Rune of Death mysteries and transformation!
    It did strike me after the fact that FE upside down could represent the tower or loss of position, wealth and status, but I would ascribe the power of destruction and creation more to UR, the great Auroch.

    I may be a bit odd here but I actually start my rune-cycle with UR and end with FE. To me, the Auroch represents the wild, untamed and sometimes destructive forces of nature that have within them all that is required to sustain life. Nomadic hunters and ancient man would have depended on the Auroch for all his basic needs, as the American Indian relied on the Buffalo. It is that bovine principle that is linked with Muspellsheimr. At the end, FE is also a bovine, but now a domesticated one and one that denotes wealth and ownership. They never owned the Auroch, but you can own cattle and thus complete the cycle. UR and FE are a bit like Yin and Yang. This cycle symbolizes mans mastery of nature and his rise into civility and beyond which is what the runes describe. Well to me at least.

    I disagree that FE in itself represents destruction and creation, (mystery and death/rebirth being more linked to Peortra I think). I suspect that main flavour of this rune is in fact fulfillment and success. Bearing in mind that life is cyclic and all you ever do complete one cycle before starting the next.Your docile cattle soon turn back into the raging Auroch. However I suspect that the runes are so ancient and so much knowledge has been lost, that every person must come to a personal accord with them.

    Ansuz is the God rune...when god created the universe he spoke a word, the breath of God was imbued with a power that is Ansuz. This is why the rune is associated with the element of air and intellect. I would think that the magician be linked with this rune, as the link between the source of all creation and that which was created.
    Last edited by S33k3R; 05-13-2009 at 10:16 AM.
    Prick your finger it is done
    The Moon has now eclipsed the Sun
    The Angel has spread its wings
    The time has come for bitter things

  10. #10
    R
    redhand Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by S33k3R View Post
    It did strike me after the fact that FE upside down could represent the tower or loss of position, wealth and status, but I would ascribe the power of destruction and creation more to UR, the great Auroch.

    I may be a bit odd here but I actually start my rune-cycle with UR and end with FE. To me, the Auroch represents the wild, untamed and sometimes destructive forces of nature that have within them all that is required to sustain life. Nomadic hunters and ancient man would have depended on the Auroch for all his basic needs, as the American Indian relied on the Buffalo. It is that bovine principle that is linked with Muspellsheimr. At the end, FE is also a bovine, but now a domesticated one and one that denotes wealth and ownership. They never owned the Auroch, but you can own cattle and thus complete the cycle. UR and FE are a bit like Yin and Yang. This cycle symbolizes mans mastery of nature and his rise into civility and beyond which is what the runes describe. Well to me at least.

    I disagree that FE in itself represents destruction and creation, (mystery and death/rebirth being more linked to Peortra I think). I suspect that main flavour of this rune is in fact fulfillment and success. Bearing in mind that life is cyclic and all you ever do complete one cycle before starting the next.Your docile cattle soon turn back into the raging Auroch. However I suspect that the runes are so ancient and so much knowledge has been lost, that every person must come to a personal accord with them.

    Ansuz is the God rune...when god created the universe he spoke a word, the breath of God was imbued with a power that is Ansuz. This is why the rune is associated with the element of air and intellect. I would think that the magician be linked with this rune, as the link between the source of all creation and that which was created.
    Each person must internalise them as they must but, a good understanding of the culture and customs in which they come from also helps unlock these secrets.

    UTHARK has no historical validity whatsoever. UTHARK was advocated by the Swedish professor Sigurd Agrell 19th century. He tried to prove that it was in fact the original rune row but he came up with no scientific validity facts at all. This has been popularised by author Kenneth Meadows who claims that it, rather than the traditional order of the Elder Futhark represents traditional runic practice. Agrell and Meadows both believe that the Elder Futhark starts in the wrong place pointing to the incongruity of a rune of fulfillment (Fehu/Feoh) being followed by a rune of questing (Uruz/Ur). They thus argue the runes should start with Uruz (Ur) and end with Fehu (Feoh). Although the Uthark is considered a flaw by many runelogists it is very popular among rune mystics in Europe. It has many symbolical values that the Futhark lacks and thus it can be seen as an esoteric rune row which corresponds with Odins descent to Hel, the "land" of the dead. The UTHARK is also associated with the idea of the loss of the F on stones that have great wear that have wore off. IMHO

    Aurochs (Uruz) is related to the Mother of Manifestation sure enough as Audhumla but, a deeper look at this it represents the pattering and formulating power in the multiverse, the source of the ordering principles that lead to the final formulation of the world. The unmanifestated pattern of matter (this is the contrast of Isa).

    Ansuz is a correlation of Odhinn, Who is also the god of Death!LOL

    The symbol of Perthro death? I don't see that at all, the very symbol is that of divination. That of the dice cup!LOL

    This of course is just my opinion from my experience.
    Last edited by redhand; 05-13-2009 at 09:01 PM.

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